GET INTEGRAL WITH SAM HARRIS AND STUART DAVIS
Integral Naked
May 22, 2006

THE END OF FAITH?
Sam Harris & Stuart Davis

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Sam Harris is the author of the New York Times bestseller, The End of Faith: Religion, Terror, and the Future of Reason.  He has studied both Eastern and Western religions, along with a variety of contemplative disciplines, for 20 years, and is in the process of finishing a doctorate in neuroscience.

By many accounts, The End of Faith is one of the most compelling and alarming analyses of the clash of faith and reason in today's world.  Always straight to the point, Sam explains why he believes the single greatest threat to humanity is the fact that billions of people on this planet believe in things like the metaphysics of martyrdom (suicide bombers go to heaven) and the literal truth of the book of Revelation (the second coming of Christ, Judgment Day, etc).  In fact, Sam argues that in the presence of weapons of mass destruction, we cannot survive our religious differences indefinitely.  Furthermore, he asserts, our pluralistic, postmodern concern for being politically correct is complicit in accommodating and encouraging the kind of pre-rational religious belief systems that, if left to their own devices, would tear the world apart in the name of a mythic God -- and very well may.

Sam's critiques of mythic-literal fundamentalist religion are sustained, cogent, and devastating.  Indeed, it would seem that mythic religion is left without a leg to stand on -- and from a rational perspective, that's exactly right.  Sam goes on to suggest that we need to start an international discussion to get people "talking reasonably about the good," and to formulate a kind of "universal morality" based on the alleviation of suffering.

An Integral Approach to spirituality would support these sentiments, but would go on to comment on a few of the thornier issues involved in having these kinds of conversations move forward in a meaningful way.  Perhaps the most challenging aspect to contend with is the developmental dimension of human growth.  Developmental studies show that human beings all move through similar levels, waves, or stages of expanding care and concern, from egocentric / "me" (archaic, magic), to ethnocentric / "us" (mythic), to worldcentric / "all of us" (rational, pluralistic) to Kosmocentric and higher (integral).

What Sam expresses so clearly, and with such urgency, is the moral demands of rational, worldcentric awareness when confronted with the problematic dimensions of ethnocentric, fundamentalist, mythic-literal religion, and its occasionally egocentric acts of terrorism.  Unfortunately, you can't just ask people to "think differently," adopt the cognitive stance of a rational worldview, and all of a sudden they're worldcentric.  Bob Kegan at the Harvard Graduate School of Education estimates that it takes five years for most people to develop to a new stage in a way that they are truly "walking their talk."

It is because of these vertical stages of development that discussions concerning universals can be difficult.  In large part this is because at archaic, magic, mythic, rational, pluralistic, and integral, the words "reasonable," "good," "moral," and "suffering" all mean something different.

What an Integral Spirituality therefore suggests is the conveyor belt notion of religion.  Every stage of development is also a station of life, and there is a different form of religion at each level.  People are always encouraged to continue their developmental journey, but if they stop their growth at, say, mythic, that is their right.  It is then the responsibility of an Integral Approach to governance to help them live their lives as fully as they can, without them being allowed to violate the rights of people in any other religion, or at any other stage of development.  So, in that sense, an Integral Spirituality wouldn't call for the end of faith -- that is as developmentally impossible as it is wrongheaded -- but rather a healthy form of faith at each stage, because these stages aren't going away, and they can't be skipped.

Every human being is born at square one, and if they are to ever reach worldcentric awareness, they must find a way to navigate egocentric and ethnocentric in a healthy way.  For Integral Spirituality, this means not the end of faith beliefs, but the end of faith behavior.  In the interior or Left-Hand dimensions, individuals can think what they want; but in the Right-Hand behavioral commons, they must act as if their behavior stemmed from worldcentric levels.  They can't control their beliefs, but they can control their behavior.

This is a fascinating dialogue exploring the very real problems of premodern religion threatening to undo a modern and postmodern world that has not yet found a way to uncover and integrate its own thread of spiritual intelligence, and therefore offer people a way out of the limitations of the religion of yesterday, and into the fullness of tomorrow.  We invite you join in on this extraordinarily important and timely conversation....

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transmission time: 28 minutes

keywords: The End of Faith , developmental stages: egocentric / "me" (archaic, magic); ethnocentric / "us" (mythic); worldcentric / "all of us" (rational, pluralistic); Kosmocentric and higher (integral), Integral Spirituality, the Four Quadrants: Upper Left ("I," intentional); Lower Left ("we," cultural); Upper Right ("it," behavioral); Lower Right ("its," social), "What Is Integral?," fundamentalism, nuclear bombs, holy wars, jihad, Christianity, Islam, Letter to a Christian Nation, religious morality, honor killings, cervical cancer, human papillomavirus (HPV), Center for Disease Control, Palestine, world government, fascists, Franklin Graham, Pat Robertson, A Theory of Everything

most memorable moment: "We have 44% of the American population who thinks that Jesus is going to come down out of the clouds and judge the living and the dead sometime in the next 50 years -- that's virtually half of us!"

We hope you can join us in this lively and provocative discussion.

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To learn more about an Integral Approach to spirituality, see “What Is Integral Spirituality?”

NHNE's coverage of Ken Wilber and his work